The Continuing Dialogue: On Technology, Cities, and Leaving America.

1. On Technology and Cities.

Zack Riktor: [[You make a good case heh. I mostly agree with everything you’re saying. But I can’t say emphatically that cities are good/bad because God doesn’t say so explicitly. And I can’t emphatically say that technology is good or bad for the same reason. Same thing with polygamy. On a practical level it does seem to create problems. But maybe it’s just because it’s concentrating the thing. Cities concentrate people. Tech creates more leverage. Polygamy sheds light on jealousy that was already there. So is it the thing itself that is fundamentally bad or does is just magnify whatever is already there?

I do see Elon as a potential antichrist figure in that “technology” is a symbol for the sum of human achievement that conquers and becomes God. My current hunch is that the final “beast” will essentially be an AI driven savior and the ten kings will somehow turn their power/data over to the system. Try not to think about that too much though. As someone deep in tech and a student of jewry I can definitely say the panopticon is far worse than people realize.]]

Josh Johnson: I think we are generally agreed, I also have a similar hunch about the future regarding the dangers of artificial intelligence and its likelihood to be co-opted by spiritual forces to deceive people into greater godlessness, whether that is as “the Final Boss” form of the Antichrist, or something else, doesn’t really matter, it should be something we observe carefully and cautiously in the coming years and make preparations accordingly.

I appreciate you saying I make a good case, but what am I making a good case for? Ultimately I am not opposed to utilizing technology, but at the communal level, Christians should not be so dependent on technologies that they could not survive without them in the event we couldn’t get anything from China, etc. Learning the skills associated with self-sufficiency are prudent regardless of whether or not programming is useful in creating Christian alternatives to the Jewish owned tech sector or in at least providing our own people some level of security and defense against those systems. I am all for this.

If we create a grad-school or seminary in our community network, it should teach the Classical Arts (theology, philosophy, bible, history, etc), Technology (computing, AI, programming, video editing, game and web design) and Homesteading (permaculture, homebuilding, animal husbandry, fermenting, self-defense, canning, etc) all in equal measure. Lets call these the “three cardinal disciplines” of a Christian future. If we can agree on that, that in at least the near future Christians should learn to code, live off the land, and know more about their faith and how to defend it, all in equal measure, then we agree on what fundamentally matters about the sort of communities we need.

Also, by creating self-sufficient communities in rural areas and/or the third world, we are relearning how to behave as Christians in community and to build a new Christendom, at the cellular or local level. We have centuries of wisdom to build on to do this and once we get our own house in order then we will be in a better place to “bring Ninevah to repentance” at this point, they would be right to dismiss and laugh at us, for we don’t even follow our own morality or agree on the Gospel and we often do everything to undermine other Christian efforts, each sect believing itself to be “the only real Christians” meanwhile we are completely helpless to help others, even unbelievers, in the turmoil to come. How can we feed the homeless masses if we are starving too because we are reliant on the same supply chains? How can we shelter people when we will be seeking someone to shelter us? How would we flee the country if we have nowhere to go to? We can start the process of solving these problems at the same time we engage in culture through technology and art. We aren’t bimbos, we can walk and chew bubble gum at the same time, this does not have to be an either/or dilemma.

2. Is There a Dilemma Between Helping Families and Being Faithful?

Zack Riktor: [[Ultimately faith sends me into the battle. It’s holding your life lightly. Family too. How many churchboomers worked long hours, shilled for the banks, taught evolution in the schools, etc all in the name of “providing for their family” — but it’s curious that providing for your family as the highest good is also what keeps people from challenging the systems that are being built. I dunno in my situation I’ve had to face that head on. Every day could be the last and I have to accept that or I’m not really living at all. Do I hate my wife and children and brothers and sisters? Hard words. How many of the great men of faith ran into the battle? How many of the confederate troops left orphans at home? No right answers here other than being empowered by spirit of God.]]

Josh Johnson: Ultimately it is true that God gives and God takes away. He taught my wife and I this lesson when he took our baby boy, but our faith was strong in that situation because we knew and believed the Word of God. Faith and family are not opposed, but they are not equal either. Faith is a higher responsibility than family and family is a higher responsibility to freedom, but history bears out that all three complement one another, Christians are best served viewing these three ideals of faith, family, and freedom as compliments, not opposites. God can decree that our wives and children will die in persecution, and our faith demands that we remain loyal servants of Christ in the midst of that loss after the pattern of righteous Job, even if there is wisdom in remaining celibate as things continue to get dicey throughout the world, as St. Paul also advises.

However, does this then imply fatalism? Does this imply that because God can take our families away that we shouldn’t have them or that we should remain in a situation, however dangerous, however impoverished, however wicked and immoral?

God did promise to spare Sodom in the event that so many righteous were found there, but God also rescued Lot out of that situation and the Scriptures teach that the wickedness of Sodom grieved the righteous heart of Lot. I would be remiss to quote again all the examples of where Scripture teaches the prudence of fleeing a nation that is morally evil, persecuting of Christians, or entering into warfare or violent conflict. Whether it is by the words of Solomon the Wise, St. John the beloved Apostle, or Christ Himself, there are real times where God calls Christians, and especially families, to safety. Not only has this been the case, but times when nations are under clear and obvious divine judgment as defined by Scripture are the most obvious times when Christians are supposed to pay heed to their specific times and circumstances and make plans accordingly to get out of danger.

We are to be open and courageous in martyrdom, we are to fear God rather than men, and we are not to even worry about those that can destroy the body or what we should say when they drag us into court. No! We are to be bold in our faith.

However, it is patently absurd to suggest that this somehow makes us a suicide cult where we cease to marry and reproduce altogether and run straight into danger and persecution. Some of what you say seems a bit cynical, but I want to encourage you to not take the pessimistic outlook your life has given you and use that to be dismissive of the needs of God’s people. I say this with sincere pastoral concern.

3. On Faith and Prudence Continued.

Zack Riktor:[[Things do get a little more complicated in a global environment. Can’t exactly load up the wagons and spread out across europe anymore. The panopticon is everywhere. I think something like what Doug Wilson is doing is smart. If you get enough Christian density you can actually put up some guerilla resistance. If you’re in the hinterlands they may come after you last but when they get to you there won’t be much of a fight. On one hand I definitely get that demographics is destiny, but the asymmetric power provided by tech might not make much of a difference in the end. Like 100 strapping strong sons vs 5,000 kamikaze drones, good luck. Probably unhelpful conjecture really.]]

Josh Johnson: Demographics are destiny, but if you believe so much in “God miraculously saving us when the chips are stacked against us,” how much more so than if the pacifist primitive amish overcome an all powerful-totalitarian techno-state? Doesn’t that sound like a God story?

Either God can do anything or He can’t, and this idea can be applied to any dilemma of faith v. prudence. Of course, if we take a sensible “third way” approach to technology, then why can’t our 100 strapping lads build a mini- iron dome, or anti-drone disruption signals or hacking software, or perhaps an EMP device? Demographics are NOT destiny in the sense that we make babies just so they can be cannon fodder in our hopeless cause (as Nazi women who were paid to have children came to believe by 1943). No, demographics are destiny because our babies will grow up to be programmers, farmers, and preachers, not just consumers that can hold a gun.

Prudence and faith work together because our prudence is part of our faith as we are prudent in the way God defines it, and not man (By What Standard?).

We don’t suggest leaving the USA because of worldly fear over and against biblical faith; rather, we argue for a biblical prudence out of faith in those very scriptures that teach us to be prudent in such times as these

It is true that after the totalitarians take the cities they will turn to the hinterlands, but that didn’t stop Jesus from telling Christians to flee to the mountains while the Romans were focusing on Jerusalem. After all, it is not being in a rural area in-and-of itself that is essential here, it is being a small fish in a big pond, its being overlooked, by time we make the priority list it should be our hope that we are prepared for that occasion, whether it’s a last stand like WACO or simply finding a new place to call home; either way, most would agree we would rather be the last on the list to be sent to the gulags, not the first, after all, by time they get to us maybe they’ll run low on funds and have to close them down, the more time we buy for Christians, the better, there is no scenario where this is not the case.

Zack Riktor: [[It is really shocking and disheartening the last few years as the winnowing has really picked up speed to see just how few people are willing to show up. Still shocking how many people are still asleep in the pews. Based on how God dealt with Israel and how Jesus dealt with the religious leaders i’m totally MEH about the government. God will dispatch them as needed. It’s going after the wicked religious leaders and reforming the church where the real fight is. I really do think the reason China is rising is because of the Christians over there. China is the Christian nation. Maybe a smaller percentage but the ones who are there are faithful so the whole country is blessed. Amerika not so much.]]

Josh Johnson: I agree, this has been my disagreement with the Kirk project and perhaps a slight disagreement with Mason. I don’t think government reform should be our focus AT THIS TIME. There is no scenario that we can reform or take over these governments in the short term, the best we can do is tie up the electoral or judicial process to make it annoying or difficult for them to start their direct persecution of us. I would consider this a waste of time if it weren’t for the fact that it buys Christians time, which like with using technology against our enemies in big-tech, is valuable as a defensive measure.

At the end of the day, we are not in a position to reform the government until the church is first reformed. Without a unified church you cannot have a successful campaign to create a Christian government. God is going to use our secular government to punish secular Christians who hide behind its evil laws and regulations. We created the monster that will persecute us.

We are agreed that pastors are the core enemy to this vision, it is the church that has whored itself out and it is a reform of the church that is my chief goal in the Christian exodus project equal to creating the community itself. Only by getting our own house in order, reforming our practices, and unifying God’s people around a wholly biblical vision can we make real change. Politics is downstream of this work and cannot be pursued beyond mere stop-gap measures until God’s people have one Gospel and One Law once again.

Zack Riktor: [[Part of the problem is that it’s very hard to really place yourself in history. Where in the decline are we? In 12 months we could have total breakdown in civil order. Or it could be 12 years. Really hard to say. My feeling right now that the decline might be steady for awhile and then quick. A few reasons for this. I know how jews work. They always push you until you are about to break and then they back down. This pattern is happening over and over again. They push covid, then back down just before people take to the streets. Because they have massive data streams they can do realtime sentiment analysis on the entire country, state by state, city by city, and say this place has a 78% chance of taking to the streets. And that’s why they are able to push these covid or tranny changes so hard and so quickly. Take people right to the edge, then back down and establish a new more degenerate baseline, then ramp it up again before long. But because they already have so much power they don’t want any cataclysmic events. They are already winning. The BEST thing that could happen right now is some kind of flashpoint that gets people into the streets rather than a frog in pot situation. God has a way of disruptive schemes though so I don’t think we are are gonna be dragged into the gulags without extreme violence first. May God grant us the wisdom to know the times and places to fight and times and places to flee— and not look back.]]

Josh Johnson: It would be better to be prepared either way, for any scenario. Have a place in America and a place outside of it BOTH. Have technological prowess and self-sufficiency BOTH. Have Christian unity and uncompromising patriarchal conservatism BOTH. Have Christians with families and dedicated singles BOTH. Have a place to fight from and a place to flee to BOTH. We don’t have to compromise here, we can be flexible enough that we can pivot as the situation requires, just as a fighter can pivot on his feet or change his stance depending on the approach of his opponent.

4. On Third Ways.

Zack Riktor: [[You should really change your practical take on technology though. You’re giving up so much leverage and opportunity. Gun technology is awesome. 3D printed guns are awesome. You can opt-out but it’s really putting you at a disadvantage. When conflicts happen the side with the best technology has huge advantages, especially when you have the God multiplier on your side. Alot of these globalist systems are actually super vulnerable. They HAVE to keep the grid up or all that tech is a giant hunk of metal. Can you imagine some blue haired infantranny trying to march anywhere without google maps lulz. The last number of years there have been growing movements within tech to get away from FAANG and it’s only growing. It’s smaller but growing within the church— Doug Wilson and Andrew Torba might be best public examples, but there are a good number of people also working more quietly. Guys like Brendan Eich— he invented javascript and then got booted as CEO of Mozilla/Firefox for donating a few bucks to the california traditional marriage campaign. But he’s gone on to build Brave Browser and Brave Search and actually provide viable alternatives. Even the mennonites are using wireless mini computers to manage their farms. All the amish stuff about self-reliance is true, but there might be a third way.]]

Josh Johnson: I don’t know what the “practical take” I have is that you think needs changed. I am not opposed to using technology, I have tried to make that clear over and over, I just don’t want to be a slave to such and seek to have a free-relation to tech.

I would love to have a 3D printer, a freeze-dryer, our own servers, et al. I WANT you and Colin to make us the most technologically prepared Christian network in the world, but I want myself and others to be the most independent and self-sufficient Christian network in the world, I want the Amish coming to us for food when shit hits the fan, not the other way around. I want my son to learn how to make his own salt from seawater and grow his own medicines and also how to code and design and program.

THIS IS THE THIRD WAY. You have no greater ally in a third way than me, but this desire to work with Christian technologists for Christian ends does not negate the pastoral checks and balances I see as a REQUIREMENT for communal living among believers, nor the real philosophical and biblical case against the enslaving aspects of our technological society. All of those points I have made are valid and defensible, but the real practical need today of using tech for our own benefit and defense against our enemies is also essential for our survival and I am not ignorant of this. Make no mistake about it. I want the third way and we both have discussed what it should look like, it is the sum of our two positions made into one.

Zack Riktor: [[Re: the spirit of fear, yeah, it just depends on specific person. I definitely wrestle with it myself. I definitely see others that are so fearful of the times they seem to forget God actually is in control.
It’s weird because I’m like wow you have great analysis but also keep your chin up kiddo, God’s got us we just keep moving along, fear is a mindkiller— I see and acknowledge that global panopticon and I’ll raise you my superpower of being able to throw mountains into the sea. ]]

Josh Johnson: Well if you “raise me” your superpower of throwing mountains into the sea I will “call” your bet and see if your faith will win you the pot.

This is not to mock your confidence, but that sort of faith comes first from the sort of soul that has the faith to obey God’s Word in the first place in loving God and your neighbor as the Law truly requires.

IV. Zack Riktor’s Final Thoughts

I ran your last messages through some AI (open source running locally obviously heh), my messages were already deleted so didn’t include them, but here is a summary. AI can be helpful writing tool because you can just kind of brain dump your ideas extemporaneously or by bullet point and it can help organize your thoughts…

This passage argues against the misconception that critics of technology, such as Kaczynski, Ellul, Illich, Heidegger, and Spengler, are opposed to all forms of technology. Instead, these thinkers critique the enslavement and loss of human dignity that can result from overreliance on certain types of technology. The author emphasizes that tools, when used appropriately and maintained under human control, can coexist harmoniously with a self-sufficient lifestyle.

The author references the New Jerusalem described in Revelation, interpreting it as a restoration of Eden and a return to a simpler, garden-like existence rather than a technologically advanced cityscape. They argue that some technologies may indeed be anti-human, citing examples such as nuclear warheads, mustard gas, and contraceptives.

Drawing upon Jacques Ellul's work "The Meaning of the City," the author further explores the biblical case against urbanism and technophilia. They claim that the lineage of Cain deviated from the simple life of Seth's lineage, which focused solely on living off the land and worshipping God. The author connects the rise of urban centers and technological advancements to the sinful desire to become like God instead of accepting human limitations.

However, the author clarifies that Christians can still use technology emerging from the fall while recognizing its imperfections. They liken this situation to permissible yet less-than-ideal practices like slavery, polygamy, and warfare. The author cautions against conflating prudence with fear, using Proverbs 27:12 to illustrate the importance of discernment and preparedness in potentially dangerous situations.

Finally, the author challenges the notion that self-sufficiency and freedom are not inherently Christian virtues simply because non-Christians may also exhibit these traits. They stress that true freedom should not be understood in individualistic terms but rather as dependence on God's people within a community context.

Okay and then I had it write a version in a “Colorful, vulgar, sarcastic, funny style. Like it was written by 17 yo latino boy that loves God and hates corporations and the government”…

Yo, listen up homie, lemme break it down for ya'll about technology and shit. You know I ain't got no beef with the simple stuff like brushing my chompers or digging in mi jardín. But when mierda gets real and corporations start controlling us through their fancy schmancy gadgets, that's where I draw la línea motherfucker!

We talking 'bout being enslaved to these machines man, like some straight up Matrix type shit. And don't even get me started on those anti-human inventions like nukes, mustard gas, and oh yeah, let's not forget about el condón! That thing should be illegal, bro.

But wait, before you call me loco, hear me out: It ain't about hating on all technology, nah fam. It's about reclaiming our damn freedom and using tools as they were meant to be used - by US, not vice versa. Big shout out to my boy Ivan Illich who spelled it out clear as day in "Tools for Conviviality": When the tables turn and we become slaves to our own creations instead of masters over them, we gotta reevaluate some shit ASAP.

Now picture this: A world where we thrive off the land together, growing our own food, knitting our own clothes, and living sustainable AF lives without depending on these greedy ass corporations. Sounds like paradise doesn't it? Well, according to the Good Book, that's exactly what New Jerusalem gonna look like once Jesus comes back to wreck shop.

So why the fuck are we still here letting ourselves be controlled by these capitalist pigs while destroying our planet in the process? It ain't right, man. Our ancestors didn't cross oceans and risk their lives for this bullshit. They fought for libertad, hermano!

And don't even come at me with that "but God gave us technology" BS excuse. Yeah, sure He did, but He also gave us free will and brains to use them responsibly, not to create Frankenstein monsters that eventually gonna rise against us.

In case you hadn't noticed, we already halfway there with artificial intelligence taking over jobs and surveillance cameras watching our every move. Next thing you know, Skynet gonna become self-aware and we're all screwed. No gracias, amigo. I'd rather live off-grid sipping agua fresca under palm trees than be plugged into the matrix like some braindead zombies.

Oh, and don't even get me started on how this technological society is destroying traditional family values. What happened to sitting around la mesa having conversaciones en familia instead of staring at screens like mindless drones?

Pero enough ranting por mí, mi gente. The bottom line is this: We need to wake up and smell el café de despertar antes de it's too late. Reclaim your power, learn self-sufficiency skills, and most importantly, put your fe en Dios above everything else.

Un abrazo fuerte para todos los guerreros del Señor out there fighting the good fight against the powers that be. ¡Viva la revolución sostenible!

Working in communications and marketing for most of my life, knowing your audience is critical. Since latam is rising and revolutions are mostly fought by young men, I always try to communicate in a way that resonates with the 17 yo latino kid from houston. The 55 yo presbyterian accountant might throw a few bucks at you but it’s mostly all talk and they are not really gonna move the needle. A big part of why we’re being enslaved is that our objective standard of living in the west has gone up ALOT the last 100 years. Give people a steady diet of pills, entertainment, goyslop and a comfy mortgage payment and it’s hard to get them activated. It’s like when David went on the run from Saul, the 400 men who gathered with him were “everyone who was in distress, and everyone who was in debt, and everyone who was bitter in soul”

V. Josh Johnson’s Final Statement

I think the idea of an excellent summary, probably better than I could write myself, in different dialects based on the demographic we are reaching, is amazing. It is also not lost on me the irony that you just used AI to summarize my critique of technology in a way more marketable than my own words.

This represents the third way we have been discussing, this encapsulates what we can do, this should be the goal. Let us use these tools, but never be their slaves. For if you are free in Christ, you are free indeed.

I look forward to undertaking this great adventure together.

Godspeed.

-Josh

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